| Msg ID: 2787799 |
Rucker (Novosel) gig +9/-2
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| Author:An Army Guy
7/11/2023 10:56:45 AM |
For young guys that are committed to helicopters instead of the FW to airline path, Fort Novosel flight instruction is an easy way to build time and experience in an advanced-ish helicopter and get paid REALLY well. There's no military experience required to teach primary/instruments as a contractor there (never has been). Starting pay is around $98K,GREAT benefits, you only work half a day with one set of flight students, and you're only 1.5hrs from beautiful Florida gulf coast beaches. By year 5, you'll be making around $127K. No joke. It's a semi-toxic environment but one where you can still avoid a lot of frustration if you can ignore systemic/program problems and just focus/enjoy teaching your own 2 students. I couldn't stand it and left after 2 years teaching there but know plenty of guys who can put up with the BS and have stayed there happily because of pay/schedule. You'll work either morning flightline (0500-1200), afternoon flightline (1100-1700), or sim schedule depending on which week and training day you're on (sim schedule is max 6 hrs which is pretty sweet). Many days you'll work 1-2 hrs less depending on wx, other student training, of how you manage your time. You get mandatory 2 weeks off at Christmas, then 1 week to choose during the rest of the year. At 5 years, it moves up to 2 weeks, 10 years= 3 weeks. You can make a bit more doing a little OT (max 4 more hours to your day for 1.5x pay is EASY money). There are still a few good instructors to work with. Standards have dropped for the students but there are occasionally the ones who want to be there, work hard, and you can enjoy. You'll learn to fly a twin with an autopilot which can help you land a better helicopter job in the future one day. I normally wouldn't wish the place upon anyone but I have a young guy I know who I recommended do this job for 1-2 yrs as a launching experience to something else and he decided to stay because pay/schedule are so good (and it really is). |
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| Msg ID: 2787802 |
Never served minimum experienced civilians teaching how to be MIL pilots (NT) +2/-8
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| Author:Is a disgrace! We are doomed
7/11/2023 11:19:23 AM Reply to: 2787799 |
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| Msg ID: 2787804 |
Never served minimum experienced civilians teaching how to be MIL pilots +8/-0
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| Author:MOI
7/11/2023 11:37:54 AM Reply to: 2787802 |
Don't they still need to complete MOI in the Lakota? By the way...civilians with no military experience taught thousands of primary students thru WWII. |
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| Msg ID: 2787805 |
True, but they weren't inexperienced pilots building (NT) +5/-3
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| Author:time for a real job.
7/11/2023 12:07:57 PM Reply to: 2787804 |
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| Msg ID: 2787811 |
True, but they weren't inexperienced pilots building +3/-3
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| Author:false.
7/11/2023 12:22:02 PM Reply to: 2787805 |
you don't know what you're talking about bro |
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| Msg ID: 2787836 |
True, but they weren't inexperienced pilots building +1/-1
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| Author:XRMH
7/11/2023 2:39:15 PM Reply to: 2787805 |
"A real job." ??? Please name me ONE REAL JOB in the helicopter world that STARTS OUT with the pay, work schedule and benefits - not to mention the bonus PAID two weeks off at Christmas and the New Year - that Ft Novosel/Rucker does. Asking for a friend.....
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| Msg ID: 2787838 |
Never served minimum experienced civilians teaching how to be MIL pilots +0/-1
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| Author:And
7/11/2023 3:25:20 PM Reply to: 2787804 |
Vietnam |
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| Msg ID: 2787830 |
Check you accident/incident rates. They went way UP since civilian started +4/-1
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| Author:X OCONUS IP
7/11/2023 1:33:32 PM Reply to: 2787822 |
Dude, civilians have been teach at Rucker since pretty much day one. Half of my IPs (Primary and Instruments) were civilians in 1980! How does that fact reflect in "your" accident numbers? |
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| Msg ID: 2787824 |
Dedication to school or country? Time building job is not dedication (NT) +0/-1
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| Author:You sound like a fool
7/11/2023 1:16:21 PM Reply to: 2787820 |
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| Msg ID: 2787845 |
Cool gear +2/-1
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| Author:An Army Guy
7/11/2023 5:42:43 PM Reply to: 2787815 |
Not really. Old'n'tired green pickle suit, poorly designed (heavy/hot/too many straps) survival vest (MUST wear), aviator gloves, leather heavy flight approved boots, and a Darth Helmet HGU-56P... all in an un-air-conditioned cockpit in lower Alabama hot/humid air in a helicopter that you can only "spoil" the doors (which doesn't really give good airflow and limits you to 100kts), and has a hot digital screened cockpit that adds to the heat. Yeah, so fun wearing all that crap in a hot helicopter! |
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| Msg ID: 2787913 |
Cool gear +1/-0
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| Author:Agree
7/12/2023 3:31:31 PM Reply to: 2787845 |
The Army ought to have a serious think about what it's doing in that respect! BTDT in a lot of venues and finally told my last employer I know how to dress myself for the job so take it or leave it. Stopped bothering me. Lot of poor things going on in the helicopter industry, and a lot of good stuff as well. |
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| Msg ID: 2787917 |
Cool gear +0/-0
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| Author:An Army Guy
7/12/2023 4:03:03 PM Reply to: 2787913 |
Had no issues with the gear as I'd rather wear things for safety's sake (minus the stupid digital camo, heavy, too many straps survival vest when the old mesh green one from the early 2000's was SO light and much cooler in the summer). Just pointing out that "cool military gear" isn't what most people think and if you'll have to fly the Lakota expect it to be almost unbearably hot. The Army has the AC removed after it comes out of the Airbus plant in Mississippi as it wasn't in the bid contract. If the bird was originally slated to be a Medevac ship then an aftermarket AC was then installed (and a few did make it to Rucker but most of them aren't repaired when they break... at least they weren't repairing them when I left there in 2020). |
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| Msg ID: 2787928 |
Cool gear +0/-1
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| Author:Yeah
7/12/2023 5:16:41 PM Reply to: 2787917 |
I get it. Retired in '19 after 56 years of all sorts of flying in many parts of the world. The Army and HAA/HEMS were the worst at demanding silly heat harvesting clothing and paraphernalia. Helmets in both venues were a must, beyond that there were times when things just went overboard, especially in HAA. The civil version of the Lakota was no better though if the AC didn't work the med crews tended to throw in the towel if it was hot cuz inside was no more comfortable than the L. Interestingly the predecessor to the Lakota/EC145, the BK117, was less a vomit comet in turbulence. Good to see the five bladed rig and fenestron, if you like fenestron. |
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| Msg ID: 2787828 |
Never served minimum experienced civilians teaching how to be MIL pilots +1/-2
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| Author:X OCONUS IP
7/11/2023 1:30:02 PM Reply to: 2787802 |
Dude, Primary and Instruments are the same, civy or military. Get over yourself! (BTW, USA CW4 Ret here) |
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| Msg ID: 2787833 |
Rucker (Novosel) gig +5/-1
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| Author:X OCONUS IP
7/11/2023 1:39:20 PM Reply to: 2787799 |
Good post OP, and right on point! I worked with about 20 Ft Rucker IPs (mostly X-Military but one Civilian) who left Ft Rucker for a bigger payday in the Middle East. Almost to a man, they left and went back after two or three years. They like the job and lifestyle at Rucker better than they did where we were at, and left double the salary (plus), and the tax advantages, to return. They're all happy as clams there, and will be there until they finally retire or die! I'm a SW boy and NEVER like the humidity and weather in AL, or I'd have joined them. |
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| Msg ID: 2787844 |
Rucker (Novosel) gig +0/-2
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| Author:Robinson Guy
7/11/2023 5:11:11 PM Reply to: 2787799 |
What are the minimum requirements to work there, does a guy with no instrument time stand a chance? Is there a strict syllabus to follow or are you left to your own devices? |
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| Msg ID: 2787846 |
Yea, bro (NT) +1/-1
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| Author:The Texas Talking Bro
7/11/2023 5:56:13 PM Reply to: 2787844 |
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| Msg ID: 2787847 |
Job requirements +1/-2
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| Author:An Army Guy
7/11/2023 6:11:07 PM Reply to: 2787844 |
1500 PIC Must certify having a combination of 100 hours of hooded instrument, flight simulator instrument, or weather pilot time. Must have instructed students in instrument flight training. Night Flying - 75. (Night + NVG = Total Night Flying) Instructor Time - 500. One challenge nowadays is must weigh 250lbs or less in your flight gear. Instrument phase is least structured and most fun to teach. Long phase in nice FlightSafety Level D sims. For flight portion you're only limited by fuel range. Tons of different approaches in the area and many FBO's in the panhandle area have free chow when you get gas. Primary is brutal as always but it's arguably the least dangerous phase now as the only touchdown maneuvers are set down from a hover (land) and the occasional run-on landing (no anti-torques to the ground and no touchdown autos). You'll get to teach both phases; it's no longer just an instrument or just Primary section. It's certainly not the life for everyone. Silly Army reindeer games all the time (some stupid new rule to follow, a power trip individual getting upset at people about something, a new SOP with really stupid changes without fixing things that needed to be changed, etc.), it's REALLY hot on the flightline and in the Lakota dealing with students who don't study or practice pre-flight/run-on which can be maddening (WAY worse than years prior), and you're always studying as an IP to be on your game (I forgot how nice it is to be a line pilot when I left Rucker and was not expected to explain something "by the book" to someone all the time the way the Army expects you to!). The students now are BRUTAL too. Imagine the occasional dumb or frustrating attitude student of years past... that's all of them now. Very few exceptional ones. Yes, that sounds cranky but ask ANY young or old IP down there about it: we saw it happen between 2015-2020. It's legit. Just warning you that it takes patience and an "Office Space" mind-set to work there. Great pay and benefit and work schedule though. |
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| Msg ID: 2787853 |
Rucker (Novosel) gig +0/-2
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| Author:its still rucker
7/11/2023 11:47:11 PM Reply to: 2787799 |
always will be |
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| Msg ID: 2787864 |
Rucker (Novosel) gig +1/-1
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| Author:okay bro
7/12/2023 9:37:48 AM Reply to: 2787853 |
here's a tissue |
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| Msg ID: 2787929 |
Rucker (Novosel) gig +5/-1
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| Author:To
7/12/2023 5:22:52 PM Reply to: 2787853 |
a lot of people but that will fade over time. I surmise Rucker would have appreciated the time his name stood prominently and be pleased a man of Mike Novosel's stature succeeded him. Change is the constant. |
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