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Msg ID: 2716850 2 Barrel rolls? +0/-10     
Author:anonymous
1/13/2022 11:05:54 AM
Hearing the Lifenet aircraft experienced 2 barrel rolls while on autopilot in cruise flight which prompted the landing, unknown control authority after he got it back under control but the ring camera that caught the quick descent showed some pitch oscillations at the bottom before he overflew the camera.

The other doorbell camera of the landing you can hear the rpm decreasing on the first contact with a tree before aircraft appears in frame. Once it rolls over you can hear the engines still running but sounds too quiet especially during the landing, they may have been rolled to idle just as he was coming into the top of the tree line, possible the hydraulics could have been fighting him trying to keep the collective from rising and rolling off was the only was to ensure the continued flight to the ground.


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Msg ID: 2716852 You people are something else +7/-1     
Author:Anonymous
1/13/2022 11:14:04 AM

Reply to: 2716850

First, all you hear on that doorbell camera is an OVERSPEED from what I imagine him dumping the collective.  Then the RPM recovers to 100% when he applies level off power.  The rest of the bs you've just spewed is exactly that, bs



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Msg ID: 2716876 You people are something else +1/-0     
Author:Anonymous
1/13/2022 11:58:34 AM

Reply to: 2716852

Slight misunderstanding, i completely agree that the first doorbell camera you hear a massive over speed that goes away as large amount of pitch is pulled in at the bottom and rpm returns to 100 percent as he flies overhead. Both engines operating at full power  

I was referring to the second camera that caught the impact. You can hear as blade contact I'm guessing a tree while aircraft is out of frame the rpm is decaying. Then as it appears in frame and other blade impacts begin it is decaying further and based on how hard it hit despite the flare and I'm sure an armful of collective I think the rpm was low at the bottom. When it rolls over you can hear the engines or at least one engine running but certainly is screaming along. Granted this from a junky doorb camera microphone. 

sorry for not clearly referring to the two different videos. 



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Msg ID: 2716877 2 Barrel rolls? +0/-0     
Author:--
1/13/2022 12:08:08 PM

Reply to: 2716850

Actually hard to tell if the doppler effect was creating the changing of the frequencies

Where did you hear it did barrel rolls? That's nuts if that's what happened

We surely don't know much of the data yet. 135 pilots go through a ton of single engine training, so highy doubt this guy just botched a single engine event. I think there are a lot more facts to come out before we reach any conclusions; they may surprise all of us



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Msg ID: 2716888 2 Barrel rolls? +4/-0     
Author:anonymous
1/13/2022 12:50:39 PM

Reply to: 2716877

Its coming from the crew members that were onboard, flight control malfunction, caused by what is unknown till NTSB crawls over the HYDs but completely uncommanded right roll that got the aircraft inverted twice before pilot could fight it back.  Collective flat pitch to get on the ground as fast as possible, overspeed of rotor system which at that point would be the least of my concerns.  What happened in the next 20-30 seconds till the landing and how much control he had vs hyds trying to pull the aircraft on its side or who knows what is the unknown.  Thankfully aircraft didnt burn, everyone walked away, pilot got some serious injuries but alive.  Expecting some AD/EASB's in the coming weeks as they take the HYD pack apart and see what happened.



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Msg ID: 2716891 2 Barrel rolls? +1/-0     
Author:Just me again
1/13/2022 1:18:34 PM

Reply to: 2716850

Or do you mean, uncommanded spin?  This video, although potatoe quality might be showing a spin at the 43 sec mark.



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Msg ID: 2716893 2 Barrel rolls? +0/-0     
Author:oldNtired
1/13/2022 1:56:07 PM

Reply to: 2716891

If they truely went inverted, Their lucky they arrived with a tailboom



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Msg ID: 2717097 2 Barrel rolls? (NT) +0/-0     
Author:Great point
1/14/2022 11:09:14 PM

Reply to: 2716893


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Msg ID: 2717243 2 Barrel rolls? +0/-0     
Author:Does
1/15/2022 11:28:23 PM

Reply to: 2716891

appear either a video anomaly or a 360 yaw axis turn.  If the latter the resumption of its seemingly original flight path looks a tad too seemless but these events do have many surprises for sure.



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Msg ID: 2716899 2 Barrel rolls? +0/-0     
Author:I heard the same thing
1/13/2022 2:31:59 PM

Reply to: 2716850

from a doctor who used to work on the program. Said he talked to both Nurses in the back. 



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Msg ID: 2716901 2 Barrel rolls? +0/-0     
Author:Anonymous
1/13/2022 2:50:17 PM

Reply to: 2716899

If this is true wasn't there an ASB that addressed this should the autopilot suddenly uncouple with no hands on the cyclic by adding a bracket/arm and a spring to the cyclic control under the floor of the pilot with a bolt/friction spring pack? 



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Msg ID: 2716904 2 Barrel rolls? +1/-0     
Author:Anonymous
1/13/2022 3:01:23 PM

Reply to: 2716901







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Msg ID: 2716911 2 Barrel rolls? +0/-0     
Author:Anony
1/13/2022 4:52:50 PM

Reply to: 2716904

Thinking about that ASB, the point where the event occurred is just about the time you would disengage the autopilot to start maneuvering for landing, especially at CHOP.  I hate to even think it but maybe hit the SAS disable red button (upper left) vs higher function disable button (black lower left). I'm assuming this aircraft had the ASB complied with. 



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Msg ID: 2716915 Where is the link to the other video? +0/-0     
Author:Emser
1/13/2022 5:18:03 PM

Reply to: 2716911

Link to other video?



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Msg ID: 2716930 Where is the link to the other video? +4/-0     
Author:./.
1/13/2022 6:58:51 PM

Reply to: 2716915

heres the moment of impact:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RkYpK0WyLvw

 

The fact he got it on the ground in a densely populated area without injuring anyone other than himself is most definitely a cause for praise. Whatever led up to this, his handling of it after the fact is excellent. He pulled off an emergency that would likely cause most of this forums judgmental morons to kill all 4 onboard. Hats off to him, let him get some praise from the media, it’s something this industry rarely gets.

 

On a separate note, I wonder how much AMC is gonna charge the family of that baby for this flight??



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Msg ID: 2716948 Where is the link to the other video? +1/-1     
Author:You don’t know
1/13/2022 8:42:47 PM

Reply to: 2716930

How much or little of the outcome was due to happenstance and good fortune.



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Msg ID: 2717226 Where is the link to the other video? +0/-0     
Author:Button’!
1/15/2022 8:04:36 PM

Reply to: 2716930

Not a dhime.



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Msg ID: 2716932 2 Barrel rolls? +0/-0     
Author:I think anony could be
1/13/2022 7:08:52 PM

Reply to: 2716911

on to something. hit the SAS disable in the sim and you're in for a wild ride.



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Msg ID: 2716937 2 Barrel rolls? +3/-0     
Author:Anonymous
1/13/2022 7:25:27 PM

Reply to: 2716932

https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/153765

Not at all saying this is what happened. But reading this article was valuable when I was learning about the EC135 & the AFCS system in particular



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Msg ID: 2716938 2 Barrel rolls? +1/-0     
Author:Anonymous
1/13/2022 7:28:01 PM

Reply to: 2716937

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5422fa2140f0b6134600081b/dft_avsafety_pdf_023427.pdf

A more comprehensive report



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Msg ID: 2716940 2 Barrel rolls? +0/-1     
Author:Hard landing
1/13/2022 8:08:35 PM

Reply to: 2716938

Lots of angry name calling over this hard landing.



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Msg ID: 2716942 2 Barrel rolls? +1/-0     
Author:Anonymous
1/13/2022 8:35:28 PM

Reply to: 2716940

Everyone needs to step back from this. Crew and patient no injuries, pilot injured but will live, and no injuries on the ground. In time those on board will be able to provide answers to what happened and I'd bet that aircraft had either the Apparo Alerts System or Outerlink System installed to reconstruct what happened. 



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Msg ID: 2717091 2 Barrel rolls? +0/-0     
Author:Pretty
1/14/2022 9:16:18 PM

Reply to: 2716942

sure it as still puttering along with Outerlink unless upgraded.



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Msg ID: 2717088 2 Barrel rolls? +1/-0     
Author:Thanks
1/14/2022 9:09:02 PM

Reply to: 2716937

If one is not prepared to deal with this type high and lower logic failures simultaneously the helicopter can definitely get ahead of the pilot.

Try the S76 at Vne under that scenario.  To me the 135 was definitely worse in divergence.



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Msg ID: 2717542 2 Barrel rolls? +0/-0     
Author:Anonymous
1/19/2022 2:45:30 PM

Reply to: 2716904

Link to full ASB?



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Msg ID: 2716949 2 Barrel rolls? +1/-1     
Author:Confirmed
1/13/2022 9:01:00 PM

Reply to: 2716899
Someone at our company talked to AMC and can confirm the 2 barrel rolls.


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Msg ID: 2717000 2 Barrel rolls? +4/-0     
Author:Nodoginfite
1/14/2022 11:13:46 AM

Reply to: 2716949

Very irresponsible to post what I heard someone told someone else what they heard from another person...stories get embellished and are as far from the truth as north from south.  Let's wait and find out from people there and see what all the evidence shows.  Wow



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Msg ID: 2717011 Pilot flew for the CIA??????? before +0/-0     
Author:according to his dad
1/14/2022 12:10:15 PM

Reply to: 2717000

who talked to reporters...flew for the airlines and flew for the CIA?????  not sure I would disclose CIA....lol



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Msg ID: 2717035 Pilot flew for the CIA??????? before (NT) +0/-0     
Author:Intel analyst
1/14/2022 3:19:54 PM

Reply to: 2717011


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Msg ID: 2717086 Pilot flew for the CIA??????? before +0/-0     
Author:Anonymous
1/14/2022 8:54:57 PM

Reply to: 2717011

yeah. cia. lol.

by the time the b*llsh*t is strained out of this one, there won't be enough solid left to line tweety bird's cage. 

 

bet on it. 



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Msg ID: 2717105 Pilot flew for the CIA??????? before +0/-0     
Author:Yes
1/15/2022 5:24:53 AM

Reply to: 2717011

he may well have.



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Msg ID: 2717119 His whole resume is on LinkedIn (NT) +0/-0     
Author:CIA leo
1/15/2022 9:13:15 AM

Reply to: 2717105


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Msg ID: 2717152 Rule: Only tell your girlfriend or wife of CIA employment… (NT) +0/-0     
Author:…not both.
1/15/2022 12:30:04 PM

Reply to: 2717011


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Msg ID: 2717202 2 Barrel rolls? (NT) +0/-0     
Author:135Mech
1/15/2022 5:43:31 PM

Reply to: 2716850


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Msg ID: 2717228 2 Barrel rolls? +0/-0     
Author:3 caramel rolls
1/15/2022 8:05:50 PM

Reply to: 2717202

and some orange juice



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Msg ID: 2717380 Video of 135 doing a roll +1/-0     
Author:anony
1/17/2022 7:12:57 PM

Reply to: 2717228

Swiss Air Force: 20 helicopters in the air (Alpnach, Switzerland) - YouTube

At the 5:30 mark



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Msg ID: 2717400 Video of 135 doing a roll +0/-0     
Author:That was
1/18/2022 1:48:13 AM

Reply to: 2717380

What is referred to in the fixed wing aerobatic world as an aileron roll. Not even close to a barrel roll. 



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Msg ID: 2717463 Because it was a helicopter… (NT) +0/-0     
Author:…what would you call it?
1/18/2022 4:43:08 PM

Reply to: 2717400


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Msg ID: 2717466 cyclic roll? (NT) +0/-0     
Author:just guessin'
1/18/2022 5:37:01 PM

Reply to: 2717463


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Msg ID: 2717464 2 Barrel rolls? +1/-0     
Author:You
1/18/2022 4:47:28 PM

Reply to: 2716850

 really think 'rolling off' was instantly available in the 135, or was it an ENG switch thing?

I.e. your idea seems not at all probable.  What the pilot did seem to do successfully is fly the thing right to the scene, aka appears he may have never given up, at all.

Irrespective of what prompted the scenario, even if it involves the pilots actions that precipitated the ugliness, the causes of all this will be very interesting.



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